Given the attention toward BurningDoom's Chrsi Jericho thread, I figured I'd start an on going wrestling discussion since there are more wrestling fants on CCL than I thought.

SO

First off, anyone wandering into this thread with intentions of giving us marks the shocking news that pro-wrestling is fake. Dont bother. W know it's fake. You know what else is fake? Comicbook and video games. But it's all just entertainment.

That said.

What are your opinions on the current state of wrestling?

I wish we could have another 90's boom. There was nothing like the attitude era and the Monday Night Wars. I'm okay with Vince taking wrestling (notice I said wrestling and not just WWE) back an era and really pushing the characters, gimmicks and entertainment value. Though I know this angers the hell out of old school and internet fans.

What do you think with WWE's current product?

I like it. But it's deffinatly been better. Nothing will be as good as Austin vs McMahon and the late 90's. But I like the push that Randy Orton is getting. I'm excited about Wrestlemania coming up soon. I really like the HBK/ JBL fued right now, too. CM Punk is doing amazing things in WWE, too. I've been following his career for years and am glad to see him flurishing. Normally I'm arguing with the internet marks over John Cena. I LOVE Cena. Most of you will think I'm crazy. And I'm looking forward to arguing with those who think I am. But as much as I love Cena, I am sick of him always having the title.

I usually only read about Smackdown. I hardly ever catch it. I was glad that they took a chance on Jeff Hardy as WWE champion, even if it was for only a month. Edge is always amazing, and I'm glad I dont have Triple H shuved in my face everyweek now.

CHRISTIAN IS BACK! I never ever even bother with ECW, but of vourse, I'm waiting for weeks and weeks for him to show up, and he comes back on ECW. Very disapointing. But oh well, he's back, and I'm excited.

What do you think of TNA's current product?

ICK! TNA is terrible right now IMO. They have tons of great talent but their booking is TERRIBLE! I mea, they're still doing a Sara Palin gimmick? What! The storylines are horrid.

But like I said, lots of good talent. Samoa Joe and AJ Styles I mark pretty hard for.

What indies/Puero do you watch?

I use to be all over some ROH. Back in 04-05 when it was really good. Brian Danielson's reigh as champion was AWSOME.

I don't follow any Japanese wrestling.

What got you hooked/ When did you start watching?

I started watching WCW in about 97. I was the hugest nWo Wolfpac fan. I was at the Georgia Dome when Goldberg beat Hogan for the world title. I think I cried I was so happy.

Sting and the nWo got me hooked. Sting was amazing. I watched it then and thought, "This guy is a real life superhero!"

But eventually I got fed up with WCW and made the switch to WWF. Best decision I ever made. I came in at late 99 and cought Triple H's title raigns. Triple H was the absolute coolest guy I'd ever seen at that time. The year 2000 is my favorite.

Who's your favorite wrestler?

Of all time? Triple H. Like I just said, what he was doing in 2000 was AMAZING.

Right now? CM Punk or Randy Orton. Orton is a brilliant heel. CM Punk's matchs with William Regal as of late have been AWESOME.

WWE LEGENDS OF WRESTLEMANIA
It comes out in march! AAHHHH! My second most looked forward to game this year. WWE.com has an updated roster of 22 superstars. More coming soon!

What are some of your other favorite moments/wrestlers/shows and whatever else?

Amen! lol

These guys are athletic (some more than others) stuntment who get beat up for my entertainment and we all know the outcome of the matches are predetermined but who cares?!

I've been a fan since I was a kid in the 80s during the Hulkamania era that was everywhere! A lot of great memories and good times...I'm even going to Wrestlemania XXV whoo hooo!!!

What are your opinions on the current state of wrestling?
It's crap, it has been since Austin and Rock left the scene. And I'm not saying that just because I like those wrestlers. It's just that WWE has been rehashing the same tired feuds and storylines ever since, and it's predictable and boring because of it.

TNA has potential, but it always falls just short. I think a big problem is the announcers, they need more humor in there. They also need to use their big talkent more. I know Kurt Angle can't get away from the camera. But other guys like Sting take off months at a time, we're lucky to see Kevin Nash beat a guy down maybe 2 or 3 times a year, and when Hogan was there all he did was run his mouth mostly.

What do you think with WWE's current product?

See my answer to the last question.

What do you think of TNA's current product?

I diagree with you. I think TNA is beating the pants off of WWE right now. The Main-Event Mafia storyline is great! I'm loving it! It's very reminiscent of the nWo invasion of WCW.

What indies/Puero do you watch?

None.

What got you hooked/ When did you start watching?

I was watching WCW right when nWo debuted and Sting was making his debut with the Crow make-up. The nWo storyline got me hooked. Then I discovered Austin vs. McMahon in WWF. This was when Triple H led D-X, Undertaker and The Rock were in McMahon's Corporation, and *shock* Ken Shamrock was a wrestler.

Who's your favorite wrestler?

Sting, followed by Triple H then Jericho. Sting was just my 1st favorite wrestler back in the day, he was awesome when fighting against nWo, and I never stopped liking him. Triple is just a freaking bad-ass! I like Jericho's arrogantness. I like Austin too just cause of his attitude. I used to really like Kevin Nash, but now he's a lazy SOB that always seems to have some surgery or injury right when he's supposed to do his big match.

WHAT ?!

Now we're getting somewhere.

Growing up in Virginia, I was a NWA fan, Jim Crockett ran the territory then (Virginias, Carolinas) I grew up on Magnum TA, Ric Flair, The Horsemen, The Road Warriors, The Freebirds, Steiners, Midnight Express, RnR Express, Nikita, Sting, Muta, Terry Funk. This is wrestling to me.

I still watch on occasion, but nothing will ever, ever touch 80's NWA, later WCW & ECW in the 90's. Wrestling is dead.

What are your opinions on the current state of wrestling?

D E A D



What do you think with WWE's current product?

It sucks for the most part, WWF still misuses every single guy they get that can become a star. Why are people like Orton & Batista in the spotlight? They're bread & butter should be HBK, Ken Kennedy, CM Punk, Jericho, Santino, etc

WWF,E whatever sucks.


What do you think of TNA's current product?

Bush league, great talent, but not good enough to step up & go head to head with the WWF,E so they can both become better & kick off another boom.


What indies/Puero do you watch?

None anymore.



What got you hooked/ When did you start watching?

80's NWA



Who's your favorite wrestler?

All time? Ricky "The Dragon" Steamboat, Sting & Mick Foley.



WWE LEGENDS OF WRESTLEMANIA

Hope this game is kickass, haven't played a good wrestler since the AKI engine on the N64.

This is slightly off topic but I had to say something. Last night I successfully found a copy of No Holds Barred starring Hulk Hogan and Tiny Lister on a torrent site. I watched it last night for the first time in 20 years. How awesome is THAT wrestling fans? (It is not available on DVD, and was never released on anything but VHS.)

June 9th, WWE is planning to release Macho Madness: The Ultimate Randy Savage Collection. A 3 disc DVD set of the Macho Man.

This is amazing news for the fans. Savage has always been a huge favorite in wrestling past, but Vince MacMahon has done nearly everything he can to forget the Madness due to a personal grudge.

Vince has been able to work with other talent that he has had heat with in the past (Honky Tonk Man, Warrior, Hogan)just fine, but Savage has alway been out of the question. While no one really seems to know why Vince hates Savage so much, the internet rumor is that it stems from Savage ellegedly having sex with 15 year old Stephanie MacMahon. Though there is nothing at all to that rumor other than internet speculation.

WWE is not in a position to cancel big money making projects like the marketing of Randy Savage. This is tremendous news for the fans.

Grew up around / watching AWA .......An uncle of mine used to work out with Rick Rude , Curt Hennig ....We used to go see house shows all the time...
Loved late 80's - early 90's WWF....
Got back into wrestling aroung 95-96 when nwo first came out...not so much anymore...mostly TNA





would be good to see....but I don't see it...

I do like the current Randy Orton push with McMahons

A little ticked with Matt going heel (again), the original intent was for the attacks to be Christian, but that aparently got thrown out. Now I have a reason to want to watch ECW with Christian there though.

I watch most of the shows from Tivo to my ipod for my comutes so I do get to see Raw/SD/ECW most every week. Kills time on the train.

My wife loves Cena and I think he is a great talent. I do wish they would stop with him being champion year round though. Hope Mysterio wins the elimination chamber this week.

I love the high fliers and Rey would have to be one of my all time favorites.

I got into wrestling back onin the late 90's, and then I stopped watching/pay attention for a few years and started watching again about 4 years ago.

Never really cared for TNA, like some of the talent though. I read up online every couple weeks to see whats going on over there.

Just a few of my favs.

coolest thing ever when mick foley got tossed off the top of that cage and landed on his coconut-yeah me 700 posts

And then he spit out his tooth...THROUGH HIS NOSE! HARDCORE!

-Nate-

What are your opinions on the current state of wrestling?

Terrible!!! This Is The Worst Wrestling Has Ever Been In Years!!

What do you think with WWE's current product?

To Predictable. You Always Know Who The Secret Guest Refferee Is By Who Has A Book Or Movie Coming Out. The Last Couple Of Years It Has Always Been Either Austin Or Foley. They Always Have A Tag Match The Week Before A Pay-Per-View Comprised Of Two Of The Main Matches Opponets Teaming Together. 98% Of The Time I Know Who's About To Come Out Based On Who Is In The Ring.

The Biggest Problem I Have Is That There Is Way Too Much Talking. During The Last Diva Search, One Episode Of Raw Only Had Three Matches. Three!!! In Two Hours!!!

ECW Sucks! With It Only Being An Hour, By The Time They Show Every Thing That Happened During Raw, Smackdown, The Pay-Per-Views, Behind The Scenes Of Someones Movie, The Make A Wish Foundation Stuff, Christmas In Iraq Etc. Etc. Etc., They Don't Have Time For Any Matches.

I'm So Over Edge. The Ultimate Oppertunist Thing Is Wearing Thin!

I Also Just Have To Say "I've Cena Nuff"! Normally When A Wrestler Loses His Title And His Rematch, They Start Back At The Bottom And Have To Work There Way Back Up. OOOOOHHHHH NOOOO Not John Cena. Nope He Gets To Have A Title Shot Any Time He Wants. I Can't Believe They Haven't Brought Back The Undisputed Championship Just For Him!!! I'll Bet If All The 15 Year Old Girls Weren't Buying His Merch, The Landscape Would Be Different.

Vickie Gurrero. WTF!!! I'll Bet Eddie Is Turning Over In His Grave. I Can' Even Talk About That Anymore.

What do you think of TNA's current product?

I'm A Big TNA Mark, But Right Now It's Not So Great. They Need To Push There Talent More. I Was Stoked At Them Bringing In "Legends" To Get Viewers, But Now They Need To Give The Others Equal Time. Also They Need To Steer Away From WWE Type Storylines. Whats Wrong With I'm Going To Beat You Up Simply Because I Want The Title?

What indies/Puero do you watch?

None. Although When ROH Gets There Show I'll Check It Out If My Cable Provider Has That Channel.

What got you hooked/ When did you start watching?

I Used To Watch Early To Mid 80's Whan I Was A Kid And Then Lost Interest. I Later Became A Fan Of The Insane Clown Posse And Started Watching WCW When They Were On And Got Re-Hooked. I Then Started Following WCW And WWF And Haven't Stopped Watching Since. Coincidently, ICP Is What Also Got Me Watching The PPV TNA Shows Before Fox Sport Net And Eventually Spike.

Who's your favorite wrestler?

Top Three: 1) Sting 2) Kevin Nash 3) Booker T (Hated The King Booker Gimmick)

Other Notables: I'm Starting To Like Alot Of The Fresh Faces. The Mainstays Are Getting Boring And Predicable (I've Seen Thousands Of Matches Where Noone Falls To The Middle Rope, But Every Time Mysterio Is In A Match...)

Anyway: Matt Sydal (I'm Sorry, Evan Bourne), Ron Killings (R Truth), Kevin Thorn (They Didn't Push Him Enough. Remember Mordecai - Awful).

Oh Yeah. I Miss Tajiri!!!

I miss mid-to-late '90s wrestling too. Today's WWE reminds me of WWE in the early '90s post-Hulkamania and pre-Attitude. The pendulum will swing back in wrestling's favor again. That's my guess.

TNA is like really bad WCW...and what's up with that crazy ring?

I started watching WWF on Saturday morning when I was really young. They were like superheroes to me, so there was a direct correlation between wrestling and comics. Then when the Monday Night Wars started, it was awesome. I was in college and everyone piled into our room every Monday night. It was great.

Favorite wrestlers: Mick Foley, The Rock, Stone Cold, Triple H. These guys were just plain amazing.

What happend to the Headbangers? They were my faves way back when

What are your opinions on the current state of wrestling?

Today's wrestling sucks. Ever since Vince bought WCW and ECW, wrestling went down. People think if wrestlers like Stone Cold, the Rock, and Bret Hart came back it will get better. I don't think so. I think with the UCF and MMA's and such, wrestling is slowly going down.
To much of the storylines are just reused materials from the 80's. How many times are they going to have the brother turn on his brother? Or a wrestler's lover (or midget) gets attacked? And why do they only focus on the "big guys" and not take a chance of the other talent...ok...besides Jeff Hardy.


What do you think with WWE's current product?

WWE sucks. They have so much talent but they focus to much on guys like Cena and Batista. It took a guy as good as Chris Benoit about 20 years to win a title that he did deserve but hand the belt to guys like Khali, Batista, CM Punk?

I like what the Legacy is doing right now on Raw. Just thought it was to much having RKO giving Steph the RKO. I was really happy to see Jeff Hardy having the title after a year of fighting for it. I was hoping RVD at the Royal Rumble meant he was coming back...guess not. I'm also happy to see Christian back where he belongs. Just wait to the draft and have him on Smackdown with Edge and the Hardyz.

What do you think of TNA's current product?

TNA has the talent to compete with WWE. Just to bad that they also focus on the big guns. Don't get me wrong, I like Sting, Angle and Booker. But Steiner and Nash shouldn't be getting that much tv time.

I do like the Main Event Mafia storyline, but maybe add a couple of members that were dominating more then just WCW.

What indies/Puero do you watch?

Don't watch any of it..sorry.

What got you hooked/ When did you start watching?

I've been watching wrestling for about 30 out of my 33 plus years of life. I remember watching Hogan when he started off as a heel. I remember the Body Ventura looking so "fairy". Being kids, we were jumping up and down and going crazy when Hogan bodyslammed Andre and as young adults cheering the nWo and DX every week. I still love it now as much as I did back then even though it really is bad to watch now...but I still love the "magic" behind it all.


Who's your favorite wrestler?

Of all time??? Bret the Hitman Hart. He was everything that HBK was only he did it first. Ok...so Bret never won the European title...that's a crap title anyway since it's not around... .
I also like Randy Savage, Ricky Steamboat, Ric Flair, Sting, Shawn Michaels, Jake Roberts, Mr Perfect, the Undertaker, Eddie Guerrero, Chris Benoit, Chris Jericho, Randy Orton, Edge, and many others.

WWE LEGENDS OF WRESTLEMANIA

Man I can't wait for this game!!!

I think a lot lof people these days, epecially, well, mostly, internet fans are missing the point of modern pro wrestling.

Pro wrestling is goofy entertainment. Plain and simple. Not to say that goofy entertainment can't be AWESOME when done right, but you have to look at it for what it is.

The days of strong kayfabe are long gone. We shouldn't be trying to tell the fans it's real when the whole world knows it's not.

WWE has adopted the phrase "WWE Universe" Witch is pefect, because the WWE, and all of wrestling, is just like a live action comic book with super characters and fights between good and evil.

I admit that wrestling has not been anywhere near as good as it was in the late 90's, but it's far from CRAP.

A lot of people look at the storylines and gimmicks of today and get mad. Why? If someone has a goofy gimmick, then why can't people laugh at it? If the guy has a goofy gimmick and is a (banned) worker, then I gan understand some frustration, but I think people are taking their wrestling WAY to seriously.

Someone said that the WWE today is to predictable. They must not have been watching the last year of WWE. Who predicted CM Punk cashing in Money In The Bank against Edge and win the World Title? Who Predicted Edge's recent loss of the WWE title and winning the World title last Sunday? Predicability is the one thing WWE has been trying to change for the last year.

And look at all the great talent in WWE right now.

Randy Orton, Cody Rhodes and Ted Dibiase J.r.- These guys, especially Orton, are doing AMAZING things on RAW. Orton is damn near brilliant.

Jericho- WOW is all I have to say.

Shawn Micheals- Nuff said.

CM Punk- One of the best workers in wrestling today

Rey Mysterio
JBL
William Regal
Kofi Kingston
Santino Marella- Not the best worker, but damn he's hilarious.

Thats just RAW

Triple H- He will never get the full credit he deserves just because he married Stephanie. People seem to forget that he was a 4 time WWF champion before he and Steph were even dating.

Edge- IMO, the nest heel in WWE last year.

Undertaker- Nuff said.

The Hardys
Brian Kendrick- Awsome worker.
Chavo Guerrero
Hurricane Helms
Shelton Benjamin

I'l admit I hav't watched ECW in months before Christian came back.

But even the most boring of wrestling product, Divas matches have improved.

Micky James- a Better wrestler than half the RAW locker room, but will always be looked over cuz she's a woman.

Beth Pheonix
Maryse- Great heel
Michele Mcool
Natallya Neidhart

True, storylines could be better. And since Vince boguht out WCW the lack of compatition has showed it's affects, but wrestling today is not THAT bad. Not as bad as it was a few years ago. It's atleast fun, even if at times it's not cool. But it doesn't have to be cool. Just entertaining.

_______________________________________________________________________

You'll notice in my rant that I havn't mentioned TNA. Thats because I think TNA is (banned). But I'll make a few remarks.

During the early days of TNA and Impact being shown on Fox Sports Net all those years ago, I was a HUGE TNA mark, but that was also one o WWE's lowest points.

Today's TNA has a few good qualities. Mostly just good to decent talent.

Samoa Joe
Alex Shelley
Chris Sabin
AJ Styles
Black Machiesmo

Plus all the older guys like

Sting
Kurt Angle
Booker T
Mick Foley
Kevin Nash
Scott Steiner

My biggest issue with TNA is their booking, but why I hate TNA is a whole nother rant.

Actually, I Called It! That Was The Most Obvious Way To Get The Title Back On Raw. I Forget Why, But Both Titles Were Being Held By Smackdown Superstars At That Time. I Didn't Call It Before Hand, But As Soon As I Saw Edge Take Kofi's Spot, I Knew He Was Going To Win!

I Don't Take It Too Seriously. It's A TV Show I Know, But You Have To Get Somewhat Disappointed At The Storylines, Because The Wrestling Part Sux! They Only Push The People That Vince And/Or 15 Year Old Girls Like And Let The Real Talent Rot. In Realitiy Shelton Benjamin Should Have Been WWE Or World Champion By Now. He Is Hands Down One Of The Best Actual Real Wrestlers In The WWE Since Benoit. The Match He Had Against HBK (If Your A Fan Of Either, You Should Know The One I'm Talking About) Was Amazing.

I'm Sorry For All The Fanboys, But John cena Can't Wrestle To Save His Life. He Has Like Three Moves. You Can Always Tell Which One He Is Going To Use. You Know Every Time He Is Whipped Into The Ropes, He Is Going To Do A Flying Shoulder Tackle. I Mean Hes The Most Predicable Part Of All Wrestling. Not To Mention The Superhuman Strength They Try To Get Us To Believe He Has. I Mean Really. He's Handcuffed To The Ringpost And He Pulls It Out Of The Ring!!! Your $#!+ing Me! Don't Get Me Wrong, He's A Strong SOB, But Really! It's Also Weird That He Gets His @$$ Handed To Him For Almost The Whole Match, Kicks Out Of Every Finisher, Then Out Of Nowhere He Hits His FU (Or Whatever They Call It Now) And Wins The Match. Please.

Orton - Great Wrestler. Current Storyline Is Decent. Would Prefer Less Mic Time. He Drones On.

Cody Rhodes - I Think Was Brought Up Too Soon, But Has Made Vast Improvements.

Ted Dibiase Jr. - A Star Is Born.

Rey Mysterio - Has Slowed Down With Age. Tired Of All The David And Goliath Matches. Hasn't Had A Decent Story Line In Years. They Have Nothing For Him.

JBL - Booooorrrrriiinnnnggggg!!! Get Ron Simmons And Restart The APA

William Regal - Highly Underrated And Underused

Kofi Kingston - Rocked From The Start. Kind Of Leveled Off.

Santino Marella -



You Hit The Nail On The Head.

HHH - What Credit? I Don't Care That Much For Him, But He IS WWE. You Want To Give Him Credit On Top Of His 13 Title Reigns?

Edge - Too Much Man. Too Much. They Need To Back Him Off A Little. You Know What They Say About Too Much Of A Good Thing...

Undertaker - Best Current Legend. Need To Think About Hanging It Up. All his Storylines Are The Same And He Takes Too Much Time Off.

Hardy Boys - Wish They Wouldn't Have Replaced Christian With Matt Hardy In The Jeff Hardy Storyline. It Has Already Been Done. Thats Hao They Became Single Competitors To Begin With.

Christian - Was Set To Blow Up Huge When He Came In, Except Vince Don't Like Him So He Will Soon Be A Midcarder. Should Go Back To TNA As Soon As He Can!!!

Kendrick, Chavo, Helms - "Yawn" Useless Since They Dropped The Cruiserweight Title.

Women's Divsion - I Could Go Either Way On That One. For Every Decent Wrestler, You Have A Hottie "Trying" To Wrestle And It Comes Off Stupid! All The Great Ones Have Left. Mickey James Is Reallyy The Only One Worth A Damn.

If I Ticked Anybody Off, I'm Sorry. These Are Just One Mans Opinions!!!