CCL Messageboard

LAST UPDATE - 14 May 2011
The purpose of this thread is to bring the attention of comics that have counterfeit copies out in circulation to collectors who may not be aware of them. It was originally discussed HERE and this will be the list. PLEASE: only list confirmed counterfeits and no post whoring! If you'd like to add a comic to the list please feel free to PM me with all the details. Thank you!

Anita Blake: Vampire Hunter - Guilty Pleasures #1 (Marvel: 2006) - "Gold Foil Variant"
Not published by Marvel. Passed off as a rare incentive variant. Click below to enlarge.



Batman #497 (DC: 1993) - "Platinum Edition"
Not published by DC. No photo currently available.

Cerebus #1 (Aardvark-Vanaheim: 1977)
Counterfeits have a dark, black spotted background on the front cover with glossy interiors and generally have bronze staples. Red color on the cover also has an orange tint to it. Genuine copies may have smudging on the front covers due to the low quality printing are were limited to 2,000. Below is a comparison of each. Click to enlarge.



Cry For Dawn #1 (Sirius/CFD: 1989)
Counterfeits have a "checker board" like pattern in the background of the clouds and are printed slightly lighter than originals. Some may have blotty printing. Printing on genuine issues is smooth. There are an estimated 100 counterfeit issues in circulation.Below are close ups of both. Click to enlarge.



Eerie #1 (Warren: 1965)
Some counterfeits have staples with a blue line on them. More prominate features of counterfeits are the bald man on page 18 panal 5, who is clearly detailed in fakes and less visible in genuine copies. The lines on the roof of the house of page 1, where the lines are broken in forgeries. Only 200 originals were made. Click below for a high res scan of a genuine issue.



Gobbledygook #1 (Mirage: 1984)
Some counterfeits are designated by having a yellow cover/interior with a badly forged Keven Eastman signature inside saying "_ of 500". Others may have a blue cover. Only 50 were made of the genuine comic and they were not numbered/signed. Other counterfeits have darkened interior cover art on glossy white pages with an Eastman signature saying "_ of 150". Click below for genuine cover image and interior comparisons. More images of counterfeits soon to come.



Gobbledygook #2 (Mirage: 1984)
Same counterfeit description as above. Click image below for genuine cover image and interior comparisons. More images of counterfeits soon to come.



Incredible Hulk Vol. 3 #104 (Marvel: 2007) - "Gold Foil Variant"
Not published by Marvel. Passed off as an ultra rare 1:1000 or 1/1000 variant. No photo currently available.

Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles #1 (Mirage: 1984)
Some counterfeits were printed with glossy or very white paper. Genuine copies were printed on newsprint and only 3,000 were made. They do not say "First Printing" anywhere in the book. Some counterfeits have some sort of creasing or scratching across the middle of the back cover while most others have a blueish tint to the black ink/background on the front cover. Lines where red and black inks meet do not line up correctly, most noticeably on the sword tip in the cover title. Red color background on fakes do not match red color on originals. Images for comparison below. Click to enlarge



Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles #2 (Mirage: 1984)
Counterfeits were printed on a thicker glossy stock. Images soon to come.

Thor Vol. 3 #1 (Marvel: 2007) - "Gold Foil Variant"
Not published by Marvel. Passed off as an ultra rare 1:1000 or 1/1000 variant. Click on image to enlarge.



Uncanny X-Men #94 (Marvel: 1975)
CGC detected counterfeit copies of this book. No available details at this time.Click to enlarge.




Venom: Lethal Protector #1 (Marvel: 1993) - black/error/misprint cover
Counterfeits have a Marvel logo in upper-left hand corner that is made to appear like a normal unaffected logo. Genuine misprints have a logo that is an obviously errored blue box/squared logo, but you can still make out the "Marvel Comics" impression with some. Genuine copies also have some of the red laserfoil intended to be printed on the cover still there, but it will differ from issue to issue. The "Lethal Protector" text may not be visible on all copies. Counterfeits have an all black background. Below is an example of a genuine misprint. Click to enlarge.



World War Hulk #1 (Marvel: 2007) - "Gold Foil Variant"
Not published by Marvel. Passed off as an ultra rare 1:1000 or 1/1000 variant. No photo currently availible

Woah, as soon as I saw this I ran and checked my Lethal Protector #1. Its real though

UPDATE - 15 May 2008

Cry For Dawn #1 counterfeit issue has been added to the list with detection details.

I still haven't been able to find a photo of the Batman #497 counterfeit and I swear to God I'm going to get around to editing those TMNT images soon

you will not

There has been something that has popped up and come to my attention in the last month or so that I haven't had time to investigate much into, and I call upon the CCL community for help.

THOR #1 Gold 1:1000 Variant

Joe and I saw a copy of this book as well as a World War Hulk #1 Gold Edition at one of the cons that we attended. I'm beginning to think these are forgeries, and I'm asking you guys to help me with this. We need to let people know they are fake if they see them.
Has there been an article about these Gold Issues written somewhere... perhaps in a Wizard or a press release from Marvel?

There are 68 people on CCL who have this book added to their wishlist. We KNOW they exist, we have seen them. But we need to know if these are forgeries.

Thanks!

Gobbledygook, I've seen it on Ebay. Its a fake. Watch out if you're on Ebay.

These are real books. Don't think that every issue you see is a counterfeit. The counterfeits that have been made (despite what CGC claims) are easy to detect. They just refuse to grade them now because with new technology they'll become easier to fake and harder to detect, but like I said, the ones already made are easy. I've even given scans of an actual copy compaired to the counterfeit.

The one you're referring to on eBay, that same one that has been discussed at the Collector Society forums, may or may not be real. This is the problem with it: The only conclusive way to determing the black cover counterfeits is the interior art work. If they have darkened art or they are signed and numbered inside, they are fakes. PGX was unaware of this when that book was first graded, so unless the seller is willing to crack his seal to show the inside, I would aviod it, but it still may be real.

If you're referring to the Charles Costas fakes that sold on eBay a few years ago, (these also seem to be discussed in many different forums) they were the yellow cover counterfeits. These were the first copies he ever saw so he didn't know if they were real or not. He wrote Kevin Eastman personally to get information on the counterfeits, the same information I've provided here.

So, to detect the Gobbledygook counterfeits: Yellow Covers, Black Covers with darkened interior arts and any signed AND NUMBERED issue are all counterfeits. They are real ones out there, just very few.

Im kind of surprised counterfeitting isnt more common. If theives can do money... then they can do newsprint, it stands to reason.

Maybe I'd be interested in having a couple..

Maybe I'll take Stan Lee and Jim Shooter and the former head of shippin and recieving to find that lost holy grail warehouse where they are sitting on pallates upon pallates of high grade vintage key silver age books.

****no, of course I wont do that... but I'd sure like to make that find of a warehouse.

I have heard about them, but have never heard if they were real or not. Sorry I can't help, I would be interested in knowing about this issue as well.

The main question is:

Is the Thor #1 Gold Edition a valid produced and marketed by MARVEL product?

I know it exists - I've seen it, so I can't question that fact. In the same way I have seen a GOLD EDITION World War Hulk #1 exists. I think these were fabricated by someone else and SOLD to the public as incentives or ULTRA RARE INCENTIVES. I mean, seriously...a 1/1000 variant? Since when has Marvel tried a stunt like this?

I e-mailed marvel and left them a message on their customer service voicemail but have not had a responce yet. I will try again later this afternoon.

Spoke with Marvel's legal department today, and they are INDEED COUNTERFEIT - in fact, there are a total of 3 counterfeits floating around that Marvel can confirm with the Gold Foil:

1) THOR #1
2) WORLD WAR HULK #1
3) Incredible Hulk #104

Nice Detective work! Expunge that crap from the Database.

It is good work finding out they're counterfeit, but should they be removed? They are still comic books and they do exist. I think they should be included in the database but they should be listed as counterfeit in the cover description area. Something like "Counterfeit - Not Authorized by Marvel". What do the rest of you think?

Absolutely they should be removed. That question is actually how this list started, I brought it up last year. Check out the link at the top of this page in my first post to read what Joe had to say about it.

I don't see any link, but if Joe doesn't want them then that's fine with me; however I still feel that a comic database should include all comics, even counterfeit ones. I'm not saying that we should justify them in any way. I'm just saying that we should recognize that they do exist. Perhaps there should be a way that they could be entered in the database but not be made available to sell. Anyway that's just my opinion and it isn't anything I feel real strongly about so I won't go off on a rant or anything.

The link says HERE in blue and is underlined, or just go here:

http://www.comiccollectorlive.com/forum/default.aspx?g=posts&t=6904&find=unread

Discuss it there, why would I mind?

OK, I found the link and I see it was well discused with Dale taking my view so I don't need to say more. Luckily I don't have any nor do I want any, but I feel sorry for the person who has one and can't add it to his collection because the database won't allow it.

I agree with ComicsCastle, and Joe of CCL, that while the counterfeits should certainly not be available to buy or sell on CCL, and should not be acknowledged as legitimate, it still seems important to recognize that they exist and inform collectors to be careful. I understand that's the purpose of the sticky post this topic is under, but is that enough? Maybe it is, maybe it is not.

By the the way, GOOD JOB! Thanks you guys, you know who you are, for finding out Marvel definately never produced these particular Variants,
1) THOR #1 1:1000 Gold
2) WORLD WAR HULK #1 1:1000 Gold
3) Incredible Hulk #104 1:1000 Gold
you have done the leg work, so the rest of us know what to watch out for.

By the way, since Marvel never produced any of these they aren't technically counterfeits. They are unauthorized variants, but a counterfeit is a copy being passed off as the original. They still shouldn't be offered for sale, but it is different from a counterfeit on a technical scale.